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	<title>Comments on: Geographies</title>
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	<description>blasting off again</description>
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		<title>By: The Deathseeker &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Bakemonogatari 06 &#8211; In Your Face Part 2</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2009/08/06/geographies/#comment-1220</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[The Deathseeker &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Bakemonogatari 06 &#8211; In Your Face Part 2]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Mar 2011 15:41:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=5226#comment-1220</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] postulates that Araragi is stuck in a cycle which he cannot get out of by helping these people in the mini [...] ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] postulates that Araragi is stuck in a cycle which he cannot get out of by helping these people in the mini [...]</p>
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		<title>By: &#8220;Anything and everything can happen in this town&#8221; &#171; Pontifus</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2009/08/06/geographies/#comment-1219</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[&#8220;Anything and everything can happen in this town&#8221; &#171; Pontifus]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jan 2010 08:51:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=5226#comment-1219</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] around and between the more obvious bustle of city life (suburbia included). As Cuchlann puts it re: Bakemonogatari, it&#8217;s &#8220;the weird underbelly that, it turns out, lurks below everyday life.&#8221; He [...] ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] around and between the more obvious bustle of city life (suburbia included). As Cuchlann puts it re: Bakemonogatari, it&#8217;s &#8220;the weird underbelly that, it turns out, lurks below everyday life.&#8221; He [...]</p>
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		<title>By: The Deathseeker &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Bakemonogatari 08 - SHAFT Teased, Freud Pleased</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2009/08/06/geographies/#comment-1218</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[The Deathseeker &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Bakemonogatari 08 - SHAFT Teased, Freud Pleased]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Sep 2009 09:05:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=5226#comment-1218</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] contends that the geographies of the settings of Bakemonogatari reflects Araragi being stuck in an abyss of [...] ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] contends that the geographies of the settings of Bakemonogatari reflects Araragi being stuck in an abyss of [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Pontifus</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2009/08/06/geographies/#comment-1217</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Pontifus]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Aug 2009 18:39:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=5226#comment-1217</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I was going to put forth a different reading, but the way I&#039;ve been thinking of Araragi&#039;s situation is pretty much in line with this, on second thought. I don&#039;t think he needs help any more than anyone else -- but in &lt;i&gt;Bakemonogatari&lt;/i&gt;, everyone needs help. Appropriate, as they&#039;re all teenagers, or close enough to it, and teenagers basically live in a world as confused as the one presented here (the teenagers I&#039;ve known have, anyway). And on top of that, it&#039;s an almost absurdly vast world; the backgrounds of the first two screencaps illustrate that with their extreme examples of industrial and residential areas, respectively.

But it is possible, I think, that Araragi needs to help himself. It&#039;s also possible that, after having been helped, he has a thing for helping others at his expense. Is that necessarily a bad thing? Maybe, if it&#039;s causing him to be entrapped by directionally-confused snail-ghosts. It&#039;s possible that what he lacks is balance, and, appropriately, the setting isn&#039;t especially balanced; its most simple elements are quite exaggerated.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was going to put forth a different reading, but the way I&#8217;ve been thinking of Araragi&#8217;s situation is pretty much in line with this, on second thought. I don&#8217;t think he needs help any more than anyone else &#8212; but in <i>Bakemonogatari</i>, everyone needs help. Appropriate, as they&#8217;re all teenagers, or close enough to it, and teenagers basically live in a world as confused as the one presented here (the teenagers I&#8217;ve known have, anyway). And on top of that, it&#8217;s an almost absurdly vast world; the backgrounds of the first two screencaps illustrate that with their extreme examples of industrial and residential areas, respectively.</p>
<p>But it is possible, I think, that Araragi needs to help himself. It&#8217;s also possible that, after having been helped, he has a thing for helping others at his expense. Is that necessarily a bad thing? Maybe, if it&#8217;s causing him to be entrapped by directionally-confused snail-ghosts. It&#8217;s possible that what he lacks is balance, and, appropriately, the setting isn&#8217;t especially balanced; its most simple elements are quite exaggerated.</p>
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		<title>By: Cuchlann</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2009/08/06/geographies/#comment-1216</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Cuchlann]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Aug 2009 04:07:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=5226#comment-1216</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It could very well be that too.  That&#039;s the mark of a great piece, that it supports multiple interpretations.  I have to wonder, now that you&#039;ve mentioned it, if there&#039;s a way to reconcile both readings, in fact.  Araragi isn&#039;t exactly self-centered, not in the same way as, say, Shinji Akari.  Of course, he does set himself up for a lot of things because he&#039;s not paying attention (or paying attention to the wrong things).  Interesting.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It could very well be that too.  That&#8217;s the mark of a great piece, that it supports multiple interpretations.  I have to wonder, now that you&#8217;ve mentioned it, if there&#8217;s a way to reconcile both readings, in fact.  Araragi isn&#8217;t exactly self-centered, not in the same way as, say, Shinji Akari.  Of course, he does set himself up for a lot of things because he&#8217;s not paying attention (or paying attention to the wrong things).  Interesting.</p>
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		<title>By: Panther</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2009/08/06/geographies/#comment-1215</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Panther]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Aug 2009 02:44:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=5226#comment-1215</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[An interesting way to look at it indeed. Then again, it could also mean that he must find his solution by focusing on others and not just himself. What if his only way out, indeed, is to find himself through others, which is what the mini-story arcs are all about? There may be no way for him to redeem himself if all he does is look at himself - Senjougahara points this out in saying that Araragi would be ready to help anyone. Maybe this is because he subconsciously knows that if he focuses on himself, he might be doomed to really stall in life?

Even his younger sister&#039;s argument about him not growing up relies on his insistence to always be out on Mother&#039;s Day. In other words, in order for him to move on, he must break out of this confusing cycle he has been in, one that keeps revolving ever since he became a vampire. The one good point about his character would be the willingness to help anyone regardless of who they are, human or ghost, and that in turn may help him (because he might know he sucks too much; we have seen so many examples of him not even denying his own worthlessness) to get out of this particular funk.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An interesting way to look at it indeed. Then again, it could also mean that he must find his solution by focusing on others and not just himself. What if his only way out, indeed, is to find himself through others, which is what the mini-story arcs are all about? There may be no way for him to redeem himself if all he does is look at himself &#8211; Senjougahara points this out in saying that Araragi would be ready to help anyone. Maybe this is because he subconsciously knows that if he focuses on himself, he might be doomed to really stall in life?</p>
<p>Even his younger sister&#8217;s argument about him not growing up relies on his insistence to always be out on Mother&#8217;s Day. In other words, in order for him to move on, he must break out of this confusing cycle he has been in, one that keeps revolving ever since he became a vampire. The one good point about his character would be the willingness to help anyone regardless of who they are, human or ghost, and that in turn may help him (because he might know he sucks too much; we have seen so many examples of him not even denying his own worthlessness) to get out of this particular funk.</p>
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		<title>By: ghostlightning</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2009/08/06/geographies/#comment-1214</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ghostlightning]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 21:41:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=5226#comment-1214</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Yes, good to note the trapped situation of Araragi that the defensive posture he takes in conversations is a symptom of.

Oh the post is finished and scheduled to publish as part of analysis in conjunction w/ Macross Frontier ep 03 next week lol.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, good to note the trapped situation of Araragi that the defensive posture he takes in conversations is a symptom of.</p>
<p>Oh the post is finished and scheduled to publish as part of analysis in conjunction w/ Macross Frontier ep 03 next week lol.</p>
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		<title>By: Cuchlann</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2009/08/06/geographies/#comment-1213</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Cuchlann]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 20:58:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=5226#comment-1213</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I didn&#039;t mean to privilege one reading over another -- what I wanted to say is that Araragi can help as many people as he likes, he can help everyone in the world, and it won&#039;t do him any good until he focuses on himself.  Thanks for clearing up the difference there!  Obviously the show is also about Araragi helping a string of other people, or else it wouldn&#039;t have been there for me to notice in the first place.  ^_^  

I&#039;ve seen some people complain about how the dialogue is &quot;just abuse,&quot; that Senjogahara wins every exchange.  Setting aside, for now, that she doesn&#039;t, I think the tendency in the dialogue for Araragi to be on the defensive might also help illustrate how trapped he is.  He can&#039;t respond to what amounts to normal conversation -- odd, but normal -- because he&#039;s so trapped in his head and the vast emptiness he&#039;s opened up that he can&#039;t claw his way out of it.  It&#039;s significant his one caveat to Senjogahara is that she always be truthful:  he&#039;s having enough trouble orienting himself without someone skewing his results for him.

Finish that post!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I didn&#8217;t mean to privilege one reading over another &#8212; what I wanted to say is that Araragi can help as many people as he likes, he can help everyone in the world, and it won&#8217;t do him any good until he focuses on himself.  Thanks for clearing up the difference there!  Obviously the show is also about Araragi helping a string of other people, or else it wouldn&#8217;t have been there for me to notice in the first place.  ^_^  </p>
<p>I&#8217;ve seen some people complain about how the dialogue is &#8220;just abuse,&#8221; that Senjogahara wins every exchange.  Setting aside, for now, that she doesn&#8217;t, I think the tendency in the dialogue for Araragi to be on the defensive might also help illustrate how trapped he is.  He can&#8217;t respond to what amounts to normal conversation &#8212; odd, but normal &#8212; because he&#8217;s so trapped in his head and the vast emptiness he&#8217;s opened up that he can&#8217;t claw his way out of it.  It&#8217;s significant his one caveat to Senjogahara is that she always be truthful:  he&#8217;s having enough trouble orienting himself without someone skewing his results for him.</p>
<p>Finish that post!</p>
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		<title>By: ghostlightning</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2009/08/06/geographies/#comment-1212</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ghostlightning]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 20:49:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=5226#comment-1212</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Ugh.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Yes! I went as far as to say that the show is about characters finding the meaning behind their monstrous affliction, to perhaps take away the meaning that makes it consequential, to have less weight in their lives. &lt;/blockquote&gt; 

...was supposed to link to: http://ghostlightning.wordpress.com/2009/07/14/monsterstories/]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ugh.</p>
<blockquote><p>Yes! I went as far as to say that the show is about characters finding the meaning behind their monstrous affliction, to perhaps take away the meaning that makes it consequential, to have less weight in their lives. </p></blockquote>
<p>&#8230;was supposed to link to: <a href="http://ghostlightning.wordpress.com/2009/07/14/monsterstories/" rel="nofollow">http://ghostlightning.wordpress.com/2009/07/14/monsterstories/</a></p>
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		<title>By: ghostlightning</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2009/08/06/geographies/#comment-1211</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ghostlightning]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Aug 2009 20:46:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=5226#comment-1211</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Wow, good work!

&lt;blockquote&gt;At first glance, then, the show looks like a kind but confused teenager, rescued from his supernatural problem, helping others.  But that’s not really what this is about.  Araragi isn’t human yet, not entirely.  He wants to get back to that world, but all the signs point to him being stuck.  Not only little hints like his name, but bigger ones:  why did his school performance wilt?  It was in the transition between middle and high school.  That time also marks his transition from human to vampire and (ostensibly) back again.  His life isn’t going forward.  It’s stalled.  That’s how he got caught by the snail.  All the other figures are prey to the confused geography until they work out who they are and what they want:  Senjogahara is now able to move through a normal world.  Before, she was falling through a weightless abyss.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Yes! I went as far as to say that the show is about characters finding the meaning behind their monstrous affliction, to perhaps  take away the meaning that makes it consequential, to have less &lt;i&gt;weight&lt;/i&gt; in their lives. [&lt;a href=&quot;http://ghostlightning.wordpress.com/2009/07/14/monsterstories/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;/a&gt;]

From a response to a comment to the post, I exemplified my point:

&lt;blockquote&gt;Oho! Here’s a meaning chain (one I construct for Humbert Humbert):

Why do I like Lolita?
&lt;– I fell in love as a 12 year old to a 12 year old.
&lt;– My love is pure.
&lt;– I am not a monster.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

The meaning that has meaning, is the one that has consequence, to future health/behavior. Looking at Humbert’s answers to his question, the first 2 answers are not consequential beyond being premises to the final answer, which is the most meaningful: “I am not a monster.” This can also be simplified as “I am not a bad person,” which we can apply to the case of Senjougahara.

The unmeaning, or presence of no meaning, is not so much found, but distinguished. Sonjougahara may distinguish that her lightness does not mean she’s a bad person, and she doesn’t have to attack people with stationery.

---

However, I don&#039;t necessarily agree with the surface&#124;deeper dichotomy on what the show is &lt;i&gt;about&lt;/i&gt;. What the show seems to be at first glance, needn&#039;t be the lower rung in the value hierarchy of interpretation/appreciation. It is an &lt;i&gt;incomplete&lt;/i&gt; or &lt;i&gt;limited&lt;/i&gt; reading to stop here, but to take only the latter we could say just the same thing. I&#039;ve written an unpublished post on the dialogue of this show (and &lt;i&gt;Macross Frontier&lt;/i&gt;), where I&#039;ve identified exchanges that ennoble -- for lack of a better term, the first glance interpretation of the subject. Here is the exchange that I noted, from episode three:

&lt;blockquote&gt; A: How about you Senjougahara, do you come here often?

S: This used to be my place.

A: &quot;Your place?&quot; That&#039;s right, you said you used to live around here.

S: Well, yes. But then it all changed. It&#039;s not like I&#039;m too sentimental about it, but... For some reason, seeing how where I used to live has changed makes my motivation slip away.

A: Isn&#039;t it unavoidable?

S: That&#039;s right. It&#039;s unavoidable.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

The quote doesn&#039;t do a good job of illustrating the confusion, but the kindness is there; and more importantly, the commentary on adolescence: where kids cannot avoid change in their world and in themselves. The changes in their world, as in Senjougahara&#039;s example are almost always close to home, metaphorical while Araragi&#039;s is literal (his conflict with his siblings leading to his self-image of being &quot;small&quot; for a human being).

---

What is at first glance that is easy to dismiss/relegate as the superficial reading may be a separate and equally multi-dermal venture after all. As is the case with the love story&#124;harem tropes, it may be that the first girl (reading&#124;interpretation) wins. Personally there isn&#039;t a meaningful hierarchy of superficial or &#039;deep&#039; interpretation, only a personally preferred system where enjoyment and appreciation is directly proportional to the meaning created with the text&#124;subject through participation (reading).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, good work!</p>
<blockquote><p>At first glance, then, the show looks like a kind but confused teenager, rescued from his supernatural problem, helping others.  But that’s not really what this is about.  Araragi isn’t human yet, not entirely.  He wants to get back to that world, but all the signs point to him being stuck.  Not only little hints like his name, but bigger ones:  why did his school performance wilt?  It was in the transition between middle and high school.  That time also marks his transition from human to vampire and (ostensibly) back again.  His life isn’t going forward.  It’s stalled.  That’s how he got caught by the snail.  All the other figures are prey to the confused geography until they work out who they are and what they want:  Senjogahara is now able to move through a normal world.  Before, she was falling through a weightless abyss.</p></blockquote>
<p>Yes! I went as far as to say that the show is about characters finding the meaning behind their monstrous affliction, to perhaps  take away the meaning that makes it consequential, to have less <i>weight</i> in their lives. [<a href="http://ghostlightning.wordpress.com/2009/07/14/monsterstories/" rel="nofollow"></a>]</p>
<p>From a response to a comment to the post, I exemplified my point:</p>
<blockquote><p>Oho! Here’s a meaning chain (one I construct for Humbert Humbert):</p>
<p>Why do I like Lolita?<br />
&lt;– I fell in love as a 12 year old to a 12 year old.<br />
&lt;– My love is pure.<br />
&lt;– I am not a monster.</p></blockquote>
<p>The meaning that has meaning, is the one that has consequence, to future health/behavior. Looking at Humbert’s answers to his question, the first 2 answers are not consequential beyond being premises to the final answer, which is the most meaningful: “I am not a monster.” This can also be simplified as “I am not a bad person,” which we can apply to the case of Senjougahara.</p>
<p>The unmeaning, or presence of no meaning, is not so much found, but distinguished. Sonjougahara may distinguish that her lightness does not mean she’s a bad person, and she doesn’t have to attack people with stationery.</p>
<p>&#8212;</p>
<p>However, I don&#8217;t necessarily agree with the surface|deeper dichotomy on what the show is <i>about</i>. What the show seems to be at first glance, needn&#8217;t be the lower rung in the value hierarchy of interpretation/appreciation. It is an <i>incomplete</i> or <i>limited</i> reading to stop here, but to take only the latter we could say just the same thing. I&#8217;ve written an unpublished post on the dialogue of this show (and <i>Macross Frontier</i>), where I&#8217;ve identified exchanges that ennoble &#8212; for lack of a better term, the first glance interpretation of the subject. Here is the exchange that I noted, from episode three:</p>
<blockquote><p> A: How about you Senjougahara, do you come here often?</p>
<p>S: This used to be my place.</p>
<p>A: &#8220;Your place?&#8221; That&#8217;s right, you said you used to live around here.</p>
<p>S: Well, yes. But then it all changed. It&#8217;s not like I&#8217;m too sentimental about it, but&#8230; For some reason, seeing how where I used to live has changed makes my motivation slip away.</p>
<p>A: Isn&#8217;t it unavoidable?</p>
<p>S: That&#8217;s right. It&#8217;s unavoidable.</p></blockquote>
<p>The quote doesn&#8217;t do a good job of illustrating the confusion, but the kindness is there; and more importantly, the commentary on adolescence: where kids cannot avoid change in their world and in themselves. The changes in their world, as in Senjougahara&#8217;s example are almost always close to home, metaphorical while Araragi&#8217;s is literal (his conflict with his siblings leading to his self-image of being &#8220;small&#8221; for a human being).</p>
<p>&#8212;</p>
<p>What is at first glance that is easy to dismiss/relegate as the superficial reading may be a separate and equally multi-dermal venture after all. As is the case with the love story|harem tropes, it may be that the first girl (reading|interpretation) wins. Personally there isn&#8217;t a meaningful hierarchy of superficial or &#8216;deep&#8217; interpretation, only a personally preferred system where enjoyment and appreciation is directly proportional to the meaning created with the text|subject through participation (reading).</p>
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