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	<title>Comments on: Twelve Moments 12</title>
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		<title>By: lelangir</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2008/12/14/twelve-moments-12/comment-page-1/#comment-582</link>
		<dc:creator>lelangir</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Dec 2008 23:41:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=2267#comment-582</guid>
		<description>I can see how Genshiken - the club - is like a safebadzone, where the harshness of reality is, well, realized and self-satirized. I like that way of looking at it. That&#039;s supported through Oguie&#039;s tsundereness even though there is no apparent need to be insecure within a zone where the insecure gather, though, on the other hand, that isn&#039;t supported &#039;cause Kousaka isn&#039;t insecure in the slightest. Madarama...well, he&#039;s interesting. I loved his interaction with Kousaka&#039;s girlfriend (Saki?), especially when they were eating sushi and a food-on-conveyor-belt-eatery and the whole pants ordeal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can see how Genshiken &#8211; the club &#8211; is like a safebadzone, where the harshness of reality is, well, realized and self-satirized. I like that way of looking at it. That&#8217;s supported through Oguie&#8217;s tsundereness even though there is no apparent need to be insecure within a zone where the insecure gather, though, on the other hand, that isn&#8217;t supported &#8217;cause Kousaka isn&#8217;t insecure in the slightest. Madarama&#8230;well, he&#8217;s interesting. I loved his interaction with Kousaka&#8217;s girlfriend (Saki?), especially when they were eating sushi and a food-on-conveyor-belt-eatery and the whole pants ordeal.</p>
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		<title>By: anitations - CCY&#8217;s 12 Days of Christmas [Day 1]</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2008/12/14/twelve-moments-12/comment-page-1/#comment-581</link>
		<dc:creator>anitations - CCY&#8217;s 12 Days of Christmas [Day 1]</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Dec 2008 23:37:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=2267#comment-581</guid>
		<description>[...] Chuchlann: Nogizaka Haruka no Himitsu [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Chuchlann: Nogizaka Haruka no Himitsu [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Cuchlann</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2008/12/14/twelve-moments-12/comment-page-1/#comment-579</link>
		<dc:creator>Cuchlann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Dec 2008 22:51:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=2267#comment-579</guid>
		<description>@lelangir You could be right about that.  The one way in which Genshiken does offer a safe zone is the club itself, though -- the guys all have a place and a group of people in which they know their interests are perfectly acceptable.  That&#039;s why the repeated joke of Kousaka being frighteningly hardcore keeps working:  he looks out of place at the table, whichever direction you&#039;re looking.  And I like your metaphor of the ways the two shows examine their subject.

In contrast, Haruka doesn&#039;t have anything like that, because she knows that her friends aren&#039;t into her hobbies.  They *accept* them, but (this is me layering real-life experience onto the show here) acceptance means dick-all when you don&#039;t have a friend to share with.  

So I guess the &quot;safe zone&quot; of Genshiken is intermittent.  It&#039;s there, but not all the time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@lelangir You could be right about that.  The one way in which Genshiken does offer a safe zone is the club itself, though &#8212; the guys all have a place and a group of people in which they know their interests are perfectly acceptable.  That&#8217;s why the repeated joke of Kousaka being frighteningly hardcore keeps working:  he looks out of place at the table, whichever direction you&#8217;re looking.  And I like your metaphor of the ways the two shows examine their subject.</p>
<p>In contrast, Haruka doesn&#8217;t have anything like that, because she knows that her friends aren&#8217;t into her hobbies.  They *accept* them, but (this is me layering real-life experience onto the show here) acceptance means dick-all when you don&#8217;t have a friend to share with.  </p>
<p>So I guess the &#8220;safe zone&#8221; of Genshiken is intermittent.  It&#8217;s there, but not all the time.</p>
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		<title>By: lelangir</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2008/12/14/twelve-moments-12/comment-page-1/#comment-578</link>
		<dc:creator>lelangir</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Dec 2008 22:36:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=2267#comment-578</guid>
		<description>Huh? Genshiken in a safety zone? That&#039;s arguable I guess. It is really interesting to draw comparisons between &#039;the subject&#039; and the position of the viewer, Genshiken vis-a-vis NHnH. 

IMO Genshiken seems much more of a inter-otacentric show (we see the culture from the inside), whereas NHnH is an outer-otacentric show (we see the culture from the outside). This is supported for NHnH &#039;cause the show was all about sociocultural ridicule and insecurity etc., how &quot;we&quot; are perceived from the outside. On the other hand, Genshiken, insofar as Sasahara was &quot;the subject&quot; - the viewer&#039;s proxy (or one of the significant ones) - the show was like an invisible endoscope, an anthropological view into the lives of the otaku; seeing ridicule from the inside out. There were several scenes I remember of Sasahara playing galges by himself at night with the headphones on, a seemingly deplorable or humiliating scene. 

Lucky Star is definitely a safe zone, but I think Genshiken is more of a way to explore social stigmatization in a  less-than-sugar-coated way NHnH treated the otaku predicament.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Huh? Genshiken in a safety zone? That&#8217;s arguable I guess. It is really interesting to draw comparisons between &#8216;the subject&#8217; and the position of the viewer, Genshiken vis-a-vis NHnH. </p>
<p>IMO Genshiken seems much more of a inter-otacentric show (we see the culture from the inside), whereas NHnH is an outer-otacentric show (we see the culture from the outside). This is supported for NHnH &#8217;cause the show was all about sociocultural ridicule and insecurity etc., how &#8220;we&#8221; are perceived from the outside. On the other hand, Genshiken, insofar as Sasahara was &#8220;the subject&#8221; &#8211; the viewer&#8217;s proxy (or one of the significant ones) &#8211; the show was like an invisible endoscope, an anthropological view into the lives of the otaku; seeing ridicule from the inside out. There were several scenes I remember of Sasahara playing galges by himself at night with the headphones on, a seemingly deplorable or humiliating scene. </p>
<p>Lucky Star is definitely a safe zone, but I think Genshiken is more of a way to explore social stigmatization in a  less-than-sugar-coated way NHnH treated the otaku predicament.</p>
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		<title>By: Cuchlann</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2008/12/14/twelve-moments-12/comment-page-1/#comment-577</link>
		<dc:creator>Cuchlann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Dec 2008 21:50:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=2267#comment-577</guid>
		<description>@CCY  Yeah, it was still fun watching them interact.  But all the other elements bothered me so much.  The last episode I watched was the one where the younger sister (I can&#039;t even remember most characters&#039; names) forced Yuuto to take her all over town.  It wasn&#039;t *bad*, it just wasn&#039;t interesting.  At all.  

And I haven&#039;t seen the last two episodes yet.  I&#039;ll get to them. . .  Eventually.  :D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@CCY  Yeah, it was still fun watching them interact.  But all the other elements bothered me so much.  The last episode I watched was the one where the younger sister (I can&#8217;t even remember most characters&#8217; names) forced Yuuto to take her all over town.  It wasn&#8217;t *bad*, it just wasn&#8217;t interesting.  At all.  </p>
<p>And I haven&#8217;t seen the last two episodes yet.  I&#8217;ll get to them. . .  Eventually.  :D</p>
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		<title>By: CCY</title>
		<link>http://superfani.com/2008/12/14/twelve-moments-12/comment-page-1/#comment-576</link>
		<dc:creator>CCY</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Dec 2008 20:33:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://superfani.com/?p=2267#comment-576</guid>
		<description>The &#039;shameful otaku elements&#039; of NHnH gave it an interesting start, but all that boiled away by not even the halfway mark of the show, being reduced to just an arbitrary stereotype one could insert to create drama (see: final two episodes). Overall, I don&#039;t think it said anything on the level of shows like Welcome to the NHK (although that was more about NEETs than otaku), and in the end, I don&#039;t think it really planned to.

NHnH is still special to me, though, for perhaps a more core element of it, the raw heart-melting &#039;awwwwwwwwwwwwwww&#039; factor of seeing Yuuto and Haruka interact in such an honest (instead of pandering) manner.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The &#8217;shameful otaku elements&#8217; of NHnH gave it an interesting start, but all that boiled away by not even the halfway mark of the show, being reduced to just an arbitrary stereotype one could insert to create drama (see: final two episodes). Overall, I don&#8217;t think it said anything on the level of shows like Welcome to the NHK (although that was more about NEETs than otaku), and in the end, I don&#8217;t think it really planned to.</p>
<p>NHnH is still special to me, though, for perhaps a more core element of it, the raw heart-melting &#8216;awwwwwwwwwwwwwww&#8217; factor of seeing Yuuto and Haruka interact in such an honest (instead of pandering) manner.</p>
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